The Facebook debacle & other issues

It's confirmed. He also says that he will take time to plan the future Smart doll, considering the lack of planification before I'm very curious about seeing if there will be any amelioration.

Part of me is very excited for this new store only because I can get free flights and just take a day trip to go and get a doll explore a little and go back home. The other part of me hopes he understands with this company growth (new store, marvel/dc etc) that there will be even more different opinions than the ones that are common with us 🤷‍♀️  

5 hours ago, Pink-Yoshi said:

Part of me is very excited for this new store only because I can get free flights and just take a day trip to go and get a doll explore a little and go back home. The other part of me hopes he understands with this company growth (new store, marvel/dc etc) that there will be even more different opinions than the ones that are common with us 🤷‍♀️  

The thing I think he needs to be careful with here is with stories like the one about the girl who returned her doll in shame after an interaction with him on social media. IF that story is true, then stuff like that can go viral and quickly create a consumer backlash. Free speech cuts both ways in the US. You can shout your opinion at the top of your lungs, and then people who don't like it can loudly respond at the top of theirs. It's been a long time since I read about this, so take it with a grain of salt, but iirc public figures have to achieve a higher bar by proving actual malice in slander and libel cases too. It makes it a bit harder for them to push back on any sort of social media backlash with regards to their perceived actions and motivations.

4 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

The thing I think he needs to be careful with here is with stories like the one about the girl who returned her doll in shame after an interaction with him on social media. IF that story is true, then stuff like that can go viral and quickly create a consumer backlash. 

 

Was that the story of the girl who complained about the weathered shoes and Danny told her to return the whole doll? If I remember correctly, she complained about how one shoe was more weathered than the other. When she contacted Culture Japan, Danny told that if she was unhappy, she had to return the whole doll. He wouldn't just give her a new pair of shoes. She stated several times that she was perfectly happy with the rest of the doll, just not the shoes. I remember quite a few people offered to trade/buy the shoes from her. 

Less than 24 hours, Danny posted on his social media about his Wabi Sabi philosophy which was most likely caused by her complaint. She decides to return the doll out of shame due to all the fuss. Afterwards, I think that I read somewhere that she opened a Paypal claim, claiming the item was 'not as described' and that she complained about other things like tiny birthmarks on the body. I think that situation was one of the reasons that's all items in the store have that disclaimer when you check out nowadays.

 

10 hours ago, BeyondTime said:

The thing I think he needs to be careful with here is with stories like the one about the girl who returned her doll in shame after an interaction with him on social media. IF that story is true, then stuff like that can go viral and quickly create a consumer backlash. Free speech cuts both ways in the US. You can shout your opinion at the top of your lungs, and then people who don't like it can loudly respond at the top of theirs. It's been a long time since I read about this, so take it with a grain of salt, but iirc public figures have to achieve a higher bar by proving actual malice in slander and libel cases too. It makes it a bit harder for them to push back on any sort of social media backlash with regards to their perceived actions and motivations.

I vaguely remember this. 

He’s also going to need much thicker skin if he’s going to do any comic book dolls. I know from experience that comic nerds (myself and close friends included) can be extremely vocal when it comes to imperfections on products they’ve spent a good chunk of money on. 

5 hours ago, Eiko82 said:

Was that the story of the girl who complained about the weathered shoes and Danny told her to return the whole doll? If I remember correctly, she complained about how one shoe was more weathered than the other. When she contacted Culture Japan, Danny told that if she was unhappy, she had to return the whole doll. He wouldn't just give her a new pair of shoes. She stated several times that she was perfectly happy with the rest of the doll, just not the shoes. I remember quite a few people offered to trade/buy the shoes from her.

I don't know because I only read about it here, and that's why I was careful to qualify it with an IF. I have no idea if the story is an internet fabrication or not.

 

6 hours ago, Eiko82 said:

Less than 24 hours, Danny posted on his social media about his Wabi Sabi philosophy which was most likely caused by her complaint. She decides to return the doll out of shame due to all the fuss. Afterwards, I think that I read somewhere that she opened a Paypal claim, claiming the item was 'not as described' and that she complained about other things like tiny birthmarks on the body. I think that situation was one of the reasons that's all items in the store have that disclaimer when you check out nowadays.

The idea of slight imperfections doesn't bother me personally, and I would have no objections if a doll body had the occasional birthmark. I would probably have a problem if the face had unexpected "beauty marks." If one shoe looked like it was brand new, and the other looked like it had been worn for 10 years I would object.

Honestly, if I get a Volks outfit that has a small problem like a loose snap I just get out a needle and thread. I don't expect handmade items to be accurate to the same spec as the ashtray in a 1986 era B-52 bomber. 😄

12 minutes ago, BeyondTime said:

If one shoe looked like it was brand new, and the other looked like it had been worn for 10 years I would object.

I think that was the issue, though not that extreme. If he's going to weather the items, they should be done where a pair of shoes is part of the same batch. Real shoes tend to wear where the two look about the same, not where it looks like you just wore one of them for years and not the other.

Plus it's really exaggerated: https://shop.smartdoll.jp/collections/footwear/products/takashin-long-boots-brown

The big scratches aren't to scale for the size of the shoes. The only people who'd have huge marks on their boots like this are people who don't care about their stuff and don't take care of it, or it's actual workwear. The tear that goes through the finished surface of the leather on the toe of one boot just looks like a manufacturing defect or poor workmanship, even if that isn't what it is.

I completely lost interest in the clothing when he started doing this to such an extreme degree. At one time I wanted a pair of his high-top tennis shoes because they look good (and a lot better than the cheap ebay ones) but after he started making them look like they have dirt on them I no longer wanted to buy. Slight weathering like stone-washed denim is one thing, clothing that looks like it's nearly worn out I don't find appealing at all. I consider these dolls like anime characters given that's what licensed ones are often based on and it's the general aesthetic. I can't think of too many cases where in anime characters' clothing is shown looking dirty or worn out. I can't actually think of a single one but if I said that I'm sure someone would point out some lol.

It's personal taste obviously. I don't like overly weathered military models either; a bit is fine with me but I want something to look like it's well-maintained, not falling apart.

Edited May 2, 2019 by cfx

1 hour ago, cfx said:

Plus it's really exaggerated: https://shop.smartdoll.jp/collections/footwear/products/takashin-long-boots-brown

What's frustrating to me is that is a really great outfit. I just can't reward his behavior by giving him money.

2 hours ago, cfx said:

It's personal taste obviously. I don't like overly weathered military models either; a bit is fine with me but I want something to look like it's well-maintained, not falling apart.

I definitely agree! I refuse to pay $100+ for something that was purposely made to look like its falling apart. In the case of the boots, they should be sold unscathed and weathered at the discretion of the customer. The only items that are on trend to look weathered are jeans. I personally do not like this weather looked that Danny is trying to go with. You're essentially dressing $550 dolls in clothes that looked like they cost less than $50...

This story about the shoe is true, I've seen it live on Facebook. The customer was using her real name, and Danny posted specifically about a shoe more weathered than the other. It was very easy to recognize the customer and she received messages from hardcore fans. Danny's actions leads to bullying. Plus he recognized himself that one boot was more weathered than the other 😑

The customer was very polite, just expressing her concern in the Facebook group. She just wanted a shoe matching the other one. Danny went totally mad. The post was deleted later from the Facebook group.

Edited May 2, 2019 by Nyx Whitestar

For those who said he wasn't respecting Volks anymore , I found an old Blog of him , which is when I was following him at the time :  https://dannychoo.com/en/posts/volks

 

 

This Dollfie Dream was his muse .

 

And that is an interesting statement from him : ''While I do have some comrades who work at Volks, I've never really had the chance to hook up with the top management but now that I have, I can tell you that they are one of the nicest family run businesses that I've ever had the pleasure of meeting. The Managing Director is such a sweet lady too who is also the wife of the big boss.''

 

 

''The Dollfie Dream line of dolls is also one of the factors that has influenced my decision to produce my own doll of my mascot Mirai Suenaga too.''

And that was his post to wish an Happy Chinese New Year in 2012

 

And that was his office in 2010 , with 5 Dollfie Dream and a Mini Dollfie Dream . He was a huge lover of DDs at that time and he can't even talk positively about Volks today , I knew him back then. 

 

This is just my two cents on the matter. I am by no means a DC "Fanatic", I am not blind to everything Danny's said and does and his attitude. Far from it, but that's besides the point.

The way I see this... is like, sometimes, people forget that SmD is not "just" a company. Sure, Danny has made it quite big, but he still runs his business himself, he does everything himself, just as if it was a small business. And -any- business has the RIGHT to deny services and products to whomever they please - they can't discriminate, based on set values such as race, religion yada yada, but other than that, they can decide if they don't want to provide services or products to individuals. A sort of exaggerated example, but say you have a bakery, someone walks in and looks around and starts shouting "This cake is so overpriced? And it looks badly baked? And why isn't the frosting decorations JUST right? They've missed a spot here??". You have the right, as the bakery owner, to take that person out of your store and deny them access to your products and services.
I understand that he's blacklisted people unrightfully. People who did nothing and I do think this is unfair and wrong of him to do. I hope people can clear this up with him if they want to continue supporting his business, although I understand if they don't (if it affected me too, I wouldn't honestly).

Also, I want to say something about the shoe thing. I wasn't going to but since it was brought up now and it seems people have misunderstood cause they've only heard one side of things, I want to say this and you can think what you want of it.
I was also on FB at the time and saw what happened. I saw the girl's original post and thought she was being very polite and nice about it. She said that Danny told her to return the whole doll and she found his whole attitude very unprofessional. But Danny then posted his side of the story (he posted their correspondence, but I'm not sure if it's still up and I don't remember if it was FB, his blog or where, I won't go looking for it, if you want to believe me, believe me, if you want to look for it and you don't find it, don't believe me, up to you). Basically the girl started complaining about the shoes, he explained about the uneven weathering being part of the process, and then she started complaining about the doll too, saying she started noticing all the little things that were imperfect with it. SHE complained about the doll. And Danny told her if she's unhappy with it, she can return it for a refund, even though it's actually in the part you're required to read before ordering that small imperfections are not considered flaws and do not qualify you for a return-and-refund. So he could leave her with a doll she didn't like and shrug his shoulders and say "You agreed to this", but he offered her a refund for a return of the doll when he didn't have to. You can say he was spiteful when he did that, but even if he was, I think the way he handled it was the best case scenario, in my opinion.

Anyway, this is just my two cents. ^ ^; I know I'm the unpopular opinion here.

1 hour ago, Shailara said:

Anyway, this is just my two cents. ^ ^; I know I'm the unpopular opinion here.

I don't think your opinion is bad, because that additional information paints that story in a different light, and it looks much better for Danny under those circumstances. There is also in my mind a limit to how much an adult needs to cater to a child if the child acts in a childish fashion. It's one thing to be polite to all people regardless of age, but there are reasonable limits to how much you have to cater to someone if you come to a point where young age becomes a barrier to resolving the issue.

I'm still waiting to hear if Billy can resolve this issue with Danny. Given all the years I've seen Billy on this forum, and how well he conducts himself here and on facebook, it will say a lot to me if he can't resolve this satisfactorily. That's not to say others in the same boat aren't just as worthy of being cleared, but there is just a mountain of historical conduct data on Billy's side here.

I'm certainly not saying Danny can't refuse service to an individual, but people can judge him just as they see him judge others. For that matter he can judge any of us for our judgement of his conduct if he so chooses.

Edited May 2, 2019 by BeyondTime

11 hours ago, Shailara said:

And -any- business has the RIGHT to deny services and products to whomever they please - they can't discriminate, based on set values such as race, religion yada yada, but other than that, they can decide if they don't want to provide services or products to individuals.

I don't know the law in Japan, but in France, no you absolutely don't have this right, it's totally illegal. In France, people who were banned would have the right to sue Danny Choo for this ban. Danny would have to prove the prejudice. I think he could only win against the author of the banner.

For the "shoe story", what is still visible on social media is that Danny admits the shoes were differents on 13th march, explaining again the wabi-sabi philosophy, without mentionning the dents problems on the doll. Knowing Danny, I find it strange that he doesn't talk about it at this moment. Then Danny posted on 15th march that the customer opened a Paypal dispute about both the shoes and the doll. Here, he indeed talks about the shoes and the dents on the doll, with his usual story about wabi-sabi (plus, what I don't like here and it is my personal opinion, is the fact that he shows a photo of perfect shoes, leading to believe that, really, customers complains over nothing. I think he distort things to appear in the good light.)

This takes place after the bullying. It makes it hard for me to believe the version where the customer wasn't happy with the doll since the beginning. In that case why she wouldn't be ok with a refund from the beginning? In my opinion, and it's an assumption, she wasn't "feeling so good" after the public shaming and just wanted to obtain a quick refund. Given the facts that are still visible, it's what I understand from the situation. Still, even if the customer was a bad customer (which is possible, I totally agree that the customer isn't always right), I still think public shaming and bullying is a very bad behaviour. Danny shouldn't have bring this up public, especially when it was easy to identify the customer.

Edited May 3, 2019 by Nyx Whitestar

That article @salica linked above was posted by Danny on 05/19/2013. I think it's pretty clear he isn't the person now he was six years ago; why that is who knows. That article reads like someone who has a lot of humility; the way he writes now in general and especially how he responds to even the slightest criticism is far from that, it's someone who instead comes across as very arrogant. Success and the stresses associated with it can certainly change someone, but it's important to remember where you came from, and it really seems like he's lost sight of that.

I've been thinking for a while that those inspriational articles that I and others appreciated were maybe just a lie or facade all along, but rereading that page about visiting Volks I don't think that now. I think something has really changed for him, and it's a really sad thing to see.

Edited May 3, 2019 by cfx

1 hour ago, Nyx Whitestar said:

Given the facts that are still visible, it's what I understand from the situation. Still, even if the customer was a bad customer (which is possible, I totally agree that the customer isn't always right), I still think public shaming and bullying is a very bad behaviour. Danny shouldn't have bring this up public, especially when it was easy to identify the customer. 

That's a thing that is puzzling. He doubles down on things even when there is evidence to show he is wrong, just as he did when he intentionally mistranslated that Volks message. Then when people who know English and Japanese brought it up he changed the subject.

I've also seen him delete others' comments on instagram while leaving his own snarky responses there, which makes what he says look even worse since there's no indication what he's responding to.

I know he can't be that clueless as he'd never have been this successful at making business deals and contracts if he was.

[Double post because I can't figure out how to add a quote when editing a message...]

Edited May 3, 2019 by cfx

1 hour ago, Nyx Whitestar said:

This takes place after the bullying. It makes it hard for me to believe the version where the customer wasn't happy with the doll since the beginning. In that case why she wouldn't be ok with a refund from the beginning? In my opinion, and it's an assumption, she wasn't "feeling so good" after the public shaming and just wanted to obtain a quick refund. Given the facts that are still visible, it's what I understand from the situation. Still, even if the customer was a bad customer (which is possible, I totally agree that the customer isn't always right), I still think public shaming and bullying is a very bad behaviour. Danny shouldn't have bring this up public, especially when it was easy to identify the customer.

She was only unhappy with the shoes. I was actually talking to her at that time, and she was telling me all about her plans for her new girl. When she first posted about the shoes, it was a really polite post and she made it extremely clear that she loved the doll, and only had a problem with the shoes because one looked brand new and the other was scuffed. There were quite a few people who agreed that the shoes looked really different, with some advising her to just scuff the brand new one herself to make them look equally weathered.

Then Danny posted about the whole issue, and his supporters started posting in the SDL group about wabi-sabi. I felt really sorry for the customer then, because all that talk from Danny and his fans about wabi-sabi appreciation was clearly aimed at her, and most of the comments weren't nice. She later removed her original post and decided to return the doll as a result of the shaming and bullying.

The dents and issues with the doll were only highlighted when she opened a dispute with paypal. I have to admit that I was internally cheering her on for opening a dispute with paypal, because I think if she had accepted the refund offered by Danny, she would have had to cover shipping back to him herself. I know paypal has some sort of coverage for return shipping if there is an issue with the goods purchased. This is purely my own opinion, but I didn't see why she should be out money when she was forced to return a doll she loved and the only issue was with the shoes.

14 hours ago, salica said:

And that was his office in 2010 , with 5 Dollfie Dream and a Mini Dollfie Dream . He was a huge lover of DDs at that time and he can't even talk positively about Volks today , I knew him back then. 

 

(Removed photo for quote)

salica, I was following DC as far back as then as well.  He and CJ was one of the reasons I really got interested in buying a DD myself.  I loved the idea of the dolls on the desk.   I remember how gracious he was about Volks and Obitsu for that matter and I loved that episode where he toured their (Obitsu’s) factory.  I have been turned off little by little over the following years as he would make big promises of one thing and then do another...said he would never do limited dolls and all dolls would be available even if you had to be on a waiting list but now he has made so many that he doesn’t do this, ”Smart Doll” that was supposed to be automated then turned into regular doll, no 1/6 pocket doll, how long has it been since the plus was announced and now I am still not sold on cortex.  It just seems like a way to cheapen the process and yet to really cheapen the cost.  It is like he continues to cut corners the more he grows.

 

I had my fill when I came across the whole Vooks Doolpa stuff, but the attitude toward customers is the most concerning.  I have a SmD that I bought way back from the original owner.  I love her to bits, but I would never give Danny any of my money directly.  I used to really admire him and all of this saddens me so much.  I hate to say that it no longer surprises me though.  I agree that when he got back in with his father and they began working together, it seemed that his head exploded (ego wise).  It may just be coincidental, but something happened.  This is not the same Danny of 7+ years ago.

 

Oh, I forgot to add that he will certainly have to clean up his act if he expects to operate in the US.  He will get sued faster than lightening here if he messes around the customers.  Just putting a non-sensical notation on a website stating that you can cancel for whatever reason and that is final is not going to work, nor will his social media exploits.  He has a lot of growing up to do.

Edited May 3, 2019 by Misheru
Forgot last statement

8 hours ago, Misheru said:

I had my fill when I came across the whole Vooks Doolpa stuff, but the attitude toward customers is the most concerning.  I have a SmD that I bought way back from the original owner.  I love her to bits, but I would never give Danny any of my money directly.  I used to really admire him and all of this saddens me so much.  I hate to say that it no longer surprises me though.  I agree that when he got back in with his father and they began working together, it seemed that his head exploded (ego wise).  It may just be coincidental, but something happened.  This is not the same Danny of 7+ years ago.

 

Oh, I forgot to add that he will certainly have to clean up his act if he expects to operate in the US.  He will get sued faster than lightening here if he messes around the customers.  Just putting a non-sensical notation on a website stating that you can cancel for whatever reason and that is final is not going to work, nor will his social media exploits.  He has a lot of growing up to do.

 

We are on the same page you and me , I will never give him my money again . I did because I needed guys and a darker skin girl , and on that last purchase it took me 6 months ,that is how hard it was for me to come to turn that I was buying something from him . But now it is definitively over with how hard he made that last purchase for me .  

I'm also a somewhat long-time follower of Mr. Choo's work, and I concur that something really has changed with him. He really is a different person than he once was. People do change (or rather, life changes us,) but... somewhere along the way he went from an idealist to a cynic, and I can only assume it was the stress of his business endeavors that did it I think Danny had a great many ideas and genuinely good aspirations, too. I remember when once upon a time, he promoted a custom DD Miku- only to rejoice with everyone when Volks announced an official Miku was coming down the line. Not to... cast aspersions, but he seemed like a happier person then.

I wish things hadn't turned out like this.

I know I'm going to get Oceana, but... beyond her, I'd prefer to get all my SmD used. Because through all of the positioning Mr. Choo has done bring his company to the mainstream, he's lost along the way the genuine passion he seemed to have for his project, I think? I don't know... he takes a doll with him everywhere, but it seems now that he's done it solely for promotional reasons, and not because he enjoys doing so. That's... my interpretation, but there is definite cynicism there in his actions, an evident reactionary bitterness. I saw it when he immediately cancelled Tea Valiant when people asked if her birthmark could be changed, only to release the explanation video for why that was impossible later. It was just so...

I hesitate to use this word, and I don't use it lightly, either. But it was a narcissistic thing for him to do. "How DARE you ask me a question and suggest I change my product! You get NOTHING now and you only have yourself to blame. People disappointed, blame these people I have now opened to attack, even though I'm the one with the power to choose what my company does and does not produce." It was just incredibly... familiar to me personally, that behavior. Retaliation for a perceived attack, shifting of blame, and minimizing fault. 

All he had to say was "that's not possible, and I will release a video explaining exactly why in a few days." 

I'm rambling again, and full admission that it's not my place to hypothesize another person's motivations or anything! I just... you know. It's a mess, and it makes me sad, and it's ALSO made me terrified to interact with Danny or really the rest of the SmD community online, either. And I think that's the saddest part in all of this.

 

37 minutes ago, Mothiraffe said:

I saw it when he immediately cancelled Tea Valiant when people asked if her birthmark could be changed, only to release the explanation video for why that was impossible later. It was just so... 

I honestly think that the concept of valiant is pretty cool, and it would be kind of neat if you could choose the birthmark that she has. I would agree that it is probably impractical, especially with a doll whose appeal will potentially be a bit niche to start out with, but it seems like it was a reasonable question.

Edited May 4, 2019 by BeyondTime

On 5/3/2019 at 2:48 AM, salica said:

And that was his office in 2010 , with 5 Dollfie Dream and a Mini Dollfie Dream . He was a huge lover of DDs at that time and he can't even talk positively about Volks today , I knew him back then. 

 

 

well still many old post about dollfie https://dannychoo.com/en/posts-category/dollfie 

believe it or not back then every time you click old post about volks/dollfie related it will be redirected to smartdoll page

15 minutes ago, BeyondTime said:

I honestly think that the concept of valiant is pretty cool, and it would be kind of neat if you could choose the birthmark that she has. I would agree that it is probably impractical, especially with a doll whose appeal will potentially be a bit niche to start out with, but it seems like it was a reasonable question.

I think when he decided to make the same sculpt in different skin tones be different characters, even though he doesn't change the faceup, he opened himself up to this kind of question and it's especially childish to respond as he did. In the earlier days you bought say Chitose in different skin tones but she was still Chitose. Now he has decided those are different girls, yet they have the exact same faceup/makeup? Why? Practically speaking, I know why, but given how he has so few sculpts that he makes everyone out of, giving different names to ones that are identical except for their skin color just adds to the confusion, and also the impression that the dolls are all starting to look alike. (Well it's how I feel when I see them, maybe others don't feel the same.)

In Valiant's case, giving the tea version an identical birthmark, assuming she'd also have a different name, I think goes against what he was trying to do with her. In the real world different people don't have identical birthmarks after all. Even if that's all he could feasibly do, reacting to a reasonable and innocent question about it in the way he did says a lot about him.

[Edit: Re Valiant--what happened to his all-important wabi-sabi here?]

Edited May 4, 2019 by cfx
added comment

On 5/3/2019 at 9:11 PM, cfx said:

In Valiant's case, giving the tea version an identical birthmark, assuming she'd also have a different name, I think goes against what he was trying to do with her. In the real world different people don't have identical birthmarks after all. Even if that's all he could feasibly do, reacting to a reasonable and innocent question about it in the way he did says a lot about him.

That does make sense. 

This is a bit of a segue, but I had been thinking that some of the changes he’s making like cortex (lower cost plastic dolls) or superhero collabs are an effort to reposition his company by shifting out of the vinyl market where Volks likely dominates, and growing into new markets where Volks has no presence, or no interest.

Realistically I don’t think Culture Japan is really a competitor for Volks simply because Volks has more diversity in the toy market, dolls aren’t their only gig, and even within dolls their flagship lines are resins not vinyls. Some of his future plans seem more like an effort to create a new market for somewhat lower priced anime & non anime dolls. I say somewhat lower because I am thinking cortex dolls won’t drop below $500, if even that, unless they sacrifice other elements like wigs and handmade clothing. Building a presence in the US would fit with that effort, and there are a lot of comic / superhero fans here who don’t like anime. 

He’ll have to call them action figures though. 😄

Edited May 5, 2019 by BeyondTime
Changed Smartdoll to Culture Japan to reflect business as opposed to product.