The Facebook debacle & other issues

These comments were made in a facebook group for Azone dolls. I really hate that Danny's attitude of vinyl vs "elitist bjd owners" is spilling over into other doll groups via his hardcore followers. Even though others were politely explaining why DDs don't really count as BJDs (even including links to Volks and explaining about the earlier strung versions), said follower just rudely called them elitist bjd snobs.

Edited August 23, 2020 by bbotss
Edited "elitist bjd owners" to "elitist bjd snobs"

51 minutes ago, bbotss said:

These comments were made in a facebook group for Azone dolls.

This is streching the on topicness a bit ...

Thats a rather poorly worded dialogue... since super dollfies ?

but at the end of the day ... eh ... a doll is a doll.

though to stitch this back into ontopic land, it does make one wonder how the choo'ches push towards the kid market will affect the general view of the vinyl side of things.

2 hours ago, finnleo said:

This is streching the on topicness a bit ...

Thats a rather poorly worded dialogue... since super dollfies ?

but at the end of the day ... eh ... a doll is a doll.

though to stitch this back into ontopic land, it does make one wonder how the choo'ches push towards the kid market will affect the general view of the vinyl side of things.

I apologize for the diversion from topic. I just thought it was relevant since this shows the effects of Danny's attitude and behaviour on his fans, and now these fans are bringing that attitude to other doll communities. It was a rude shock for me to see Danny's words of "elitist bjd owners" being parroted about in groups other than Smartdoll-centric groups. My point is not whether or not certain dolls are considered BJDs (that is certainly not on topic for this), but rather the attitude of his followers and how quick they are to throw the "elitist" and "snobbish" labels around. The rude commentor was one of those quickest to shoot down people in the previous Smd group for speaking up. I thought I left all that behind when that toxic fanclub was shut down. Such comments were par for the course in that fanclub, especially since Danny himself is one of the ones using such labels on a regular basis when snarking about Volks. However, it was extremely upsetting to see such comments in another group totally unrelated to Smartdoll. But I'll stop talking about this now since it does veer from the actual topic at hand.

Edited August 23, 2020 by bbotss

34 minutes ago, bbotss said:

It was a rude shock for me to see Danny's words of "elitist bjd owners" being parroted about in groups other than Smartdoll-centric groups.

--the attitude of his followers and how quick they are to throw the "elitist" and "snobbish" labels around.

Bullies attract bullies.
It's sad to see how focus is on "the haters", rather than being used to spread positivity.

Oh no, the whole need for {insert thing here} to be defined as a bjd reminds me of conversations about art and games, and how upset people get if you tell them their favourite game isn't art. ^^; It's weird, because they're creating elitism by putting so much weight on the term 'bjd', as if that's the only type of doll which has any worth. But that's nonsense! Equal love for all cute dolls!

(I mean, the rules on DoA are a bit narrow as to what they consider an on topic (might as well say 'real') bjd - so narrow it excludes a bunch of dolls made by long established companies like Pipos, and a lot of cool artist dolls made with new technologies. But the rest of the community is a lot more open. At the end of the day, people just love dolls)

It really sucks if discourse from old groups is now poisoning other parts of the hobby. Sorry for continuing the off topic bit... but I don't like people seeing bjd vs not bjd as a value judgement.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CEOXzmIhcCf/?igshid=16tgqccerz99j

 

 

 

Edit: I have no clue why pretending that people c̶r̶i̶t̶i̶c̶i̶z̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶ harrassing them online doesnt bother you, because I have never seen a more obvious case of someone blatantly lying that it doesn't.

Edited August 23, 2020 by IgelFullmetal

I have never seen a company specificailly bring up how much 'hate" they get as this one.

Criticism is not hate! It can be used to grow! It is a tool! 

If you are getting hate or harrassed- stop acknowledging them publically and deal with it properly.It will just attract more hate if you don't!

Frankly it is SO uncomfortable.It's not cute, fun or quirky. It doesn't endear the company to me. It doesn't make the product 'exclusive' or 'lux'. It doesn't make it 'child friendly'( Especailly after posting that unboxing video from a CHILD). It just feels like the company trying for pity points? But...why? That is terribly 'off-brand' from their overall message.

And this isn't an arguement to be like "oh x,y,z doesn't do this-why aren't you like them?!?!" Or "Omg stop we don't want the hear about your problems". 

It is straight up weird branding and damages company image. If anything, it is making them look worse and 'not worth it".Like, yea, pretty suspicious you have all these disclaimers and keep talking about 'hate'. Definately makes me feel like the product isn't worth purchasing.

 

Here we go again : /. His fans are just as immature as he is, I used to think it was a joke but nope. Also that meme is just... tacky.( I cant tell if he's laughing or screaming @_@ but he looks like he's begging to be beat up hahah) Anyways, the hate he gets seems to be very....minimal? On that reddit thread, people were being pretty mean is that considered hate? I think at this point he's just confusing criticism for hate and labeling it as the same thing. Or he can tell the difference but his ego doesn't let him admit it and he's manipulating people on purpose? Does anyone actually hate Danny and smartdoll on this forum? I know before all these controversy started, there were quite a few people who expressed heavy dislike for the product, but obviously it was just preference. (Ah I'm rambling now hahah). Overall I think Danny should take his own advise and not give a sheep.( -_-)

Danny would gain more favor in my eyes if he just came out and said that what some people say online bothers him, because:

1. He's not an impervious doll making robot. He is a human being with emotions and opinions, and being critisized can hurt. However, bart of becoming better as a creative is knowing how to weed out actual, substantive feedback from bad faith takes, and using it to improve both your product and yourself.

2. He's god awful at pretending it doesnt.

1 hour ago, IgelFullmetal said:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CEOXzmIhcCf/?igshid=16tgqccerz99j

 

 

 

Edit: I have no clue why pretending that people c̶r̶i̶t̶i̶c̶i̶z̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶ harrassing them online doesnt bother you, because I have never seen a more obvious case of someone blatantly lying that it doesn't.

God, the cringe. Someone get this man a PR department stat. Can you imagine if Volks was this vindictive? 

2 minutes ago, sweets said:

Can you imagine if Volks was this vindictive? 

A vengeful Mom & Pop toy store would be something out of Stephen King.

I know what a healthy paracosial creator relationship looks like and THIS AIN'T IT.

Edited August 23, 2020 by IgelFullmetal

That's... so creepy... it really is a cult. These people are just feeding his ego. I really hope he gets it together and realizes how damaging this kind of behavior is.....

11 hours ago, bbotss said:

I just thought it was relevant since this shows the effects of Danny's attitude and behaviour on his fans, and now these fans are bringing that attitude to other doll communities.

mm, which was also why I tried to stitch it back with how the juvenile nature might affect the rest of us hobbyists in general...

 

2 hours ago, Mame said:

Does anyone actually hate Danny and smartdoll on this forum? I know before all these controversy started, there were quite a few people who expressed heavy dislike for the product, but obviously it was just preference.

Hate him? .. hate is a strong word.

But there are reasons to dislike him and his product, other than just preference. Multiple reasons, depending on how long someone has had the chance to view his career and how his product came to be.

Maybe it is just haterism I guess -- Someone could chalk it all up to just people being envy about your success, never giving much thought about how you gained the success in the first place.

4 hours ago, IgelFullmetal said:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CEOXzmIhcCf/?igshid=16tgqccerz99j

 

Cringe is the first thing that came to mind after seeing this, and the bootlicking comments are borderline creepy? how do they see NOTHING wrong? 

 

I feel like danny is the type to get criticized once then spend the rest of their life saying they were bullied and got hated on to get sympathy 😕

 

To me it is just fishing for compliments... "I drew this flower, but it looks so bad XD"

If he wants to build his company on not being bothered what others say, he should stand by it and not jojo around.
Frequently venting to customers/the public about how much hate he gets is, indeed, caring what others say!
Surely it is just to get the endorphins from the comments. - "No! Your picture is awesome!"

But I guess it does not matter when he's got such a following that doesn't see the contradiction. Boot-licking for sure...
Praise is nice, but you won't grow/evolve from yes-sayers and blind devotion

Edited August 23, 2020 by Yumeiro

1 hour ago, kino said:

how do they see NOTHING wrong? 

I think a lot of them are probably just kids, and don’t process these comments the same way an adult would. If they read them in a few more years they’ll probably facepalm. 

On a separate note, lets try and shift the discussion away from Danny and back to the dolls and his company policies. I know the insta posts invite this sort of debate and it’s hard not to vent about the nonsense, but the forum is about dolls and doll products and not Danny Choo’s behavior. 

It's pretty sad to see how Danny went from loving his Volks dolls (Saber in particular) to... This. This isn't love of a hobby anymore. I say Danny because he is so synonymous with his Brand™ and always has been. The official Smart Doll Instagram is his personal one. It's all Danny, all the time. We can talk about the company and the dolls until we're bkue in the face, but it's Danny making these decisions and ultimately reflects of him. Doesn't have to resort to name calling and what not but it is at the end of the day, his fault. 

(Unless I'm wrong and he doesn't make these decisions for Smart Doll)

And frankly, smart dolls are NOT a bad product. They have a lot of good points as to why I would choose one over a DD. For example; posing, representation, variety, aesthetic purposeful design etc. I WANT to love them too and heck if things improve I would absolutely get one of the semi-real girls because that is my absolute aesthetic. But I can't, in good conscience, support a company with such anti-consumer practices and hope that I'm one of the lucky ones who gets a perfect order first time.

I guess at this point I'm not even angry, I'm just disappointed. I don't hate Danny at all. I looked up to him once upon a time as a fellow brit dreaming of a life in Japan one day. I just want him to do better, find his love of the hobby again, and treat people how he wants to be treated.

Even with how I feel about the behaviors I see, the SmD I have are still awesome in my mind.

 

44 minutes ago, Swanmay said:

say Danny because he is so synonymous with his Brand™ and always has been.

I get the connection between Danny and the brand, but at the same time the line in the sand for this forum is don't go after the person; it's too easy for us to fall into the trap of attacking the man and not the process once you open that door.

We don't want this thread to become all about Danny bashing even if Culture Japan is all about Danny. 

I'm just frustrated because I think his dolls are gorgeous, especally the new retro-real type sculpts. I don't have much in the way of disposable income, but I was at one point thinking of getting a SmD as my first vinyl.

At this point, I dont think I would be able to buy one even if I wanted to (Which I kinda do tbh) because of what I said here and what I supposably did to his first facebook group. If other companies barred people from buying their products if they slagged them off on social media (in good faith or otherwise) I wouldnt be able to play half the video games I love.

Wow, just wow. Each time I think he can't say or do anything worse and I am literally blown away. I've had dealings with the person bbtoss was mentioning, and they were not at all pleasant. I have zero regrets selling my Smart Dolls, and I am glad that I don't have to worry about getting stalked, trolled, or worry about how to replace a broken wrist or joint. I truly feel horrible though any time I see someone new to the hobby whether it be vinyl or 1/3 dolls in general salivating at the gorgeous Smart Dolls and not having a clue of what they will be supporting/involved in. If you tick off the doll 'god': tarred and feathered and constantly bullied in future product descriptions. In my case, I'll gladly take banishment. As Johnny Depp said in Pirates of the Caribbean, "Gentlemen, I wash my hands of this weirdness."

Edited August 24, 2020 by Deyja
spelling

30 minutes ago, IgelFullmetal said:

If other companies barred people from buying their products if they slagged them off on social media (in good faith or otherwise) I wouldnt be able to play half the video games I love.

Yeah, the policies that stem from all this nonsense are hurtful for sure.

19 hours ago, HazelMaze said:

It is straight up weird branding and damages company image. If anything, it is making them look worse and 'not worth it".Like, yea, pretty suspicious you have all these disclaimers and keep talking about 'hate'. Definately makes me feel like the product isn't worth purchasing.

 

Yeah, that was definitely the case for me. All the disclaimers about how the dolls are wonky and break and you have to do this and that, and are you reeeeeally sure you want one, totally scared me off. I was afraid my Smart Doll would fall apart in my hands lol. I was afraid she would arrive with some huge defect, but she's fine. I like her a lot ^^;

12 hours ago, IgelFullmetal said:

At this point, I dont think I would be able to buy one even if I wanted to (Which I kinda do tbh) because of what I said here and what I supposably did to his first facebook group. If other companies barred people from buying their products if they slagged them off on social media (in good faith or otherwise) I wouldnt be able to play half the video games I love.

I think this is a noteworthy point, because it feels like some of the behaviour around Smart Doll stuff is motivated by fear. Gotta be nice or banned. Gotta be fawning and a pushover or banned. Gotta pretend other dolls don't exist or banned. Live in fear of the ban heh.

(So afraid of being banned )

I have so many people blocked, and at the rate it is going I will have to leave all the groups because too much cringy stuff. I am seeing so many new people asking questions and I want to tell them to RUN. How sad is that?! The way vets answer their questions sometimes really do make me cringe and puts me off. These aren't just dolls to a lot of people anymore, it really does seem to be a cult, and it scares me. That may sound stupid but that mentality does creep me out to my core, and I am having a hard time enjoying what I have because of it

Edited August 24, 2020 by CrazyDollPerson

I am sort of left wondering, considering how folks are having difficulties with the brand, that what the demand for a doll sized t-shirt with the option of texts:

 

"No chooches given,

can I haz ma'h doll?"

 

"Keep calm,

and dont

give a chooch"

 

And yes, I am being just a little, teensy bit mean ... but I am trying my best to play nice, I sware ...