Volks decisions to line some items and not others...

Just got Magical Princess Lucy in - and I only got her for the clothes (and everyone else was super to take the other parts! XD).. At first I wondered about her socks as they looked like they might stain something awful... but when I got them out I noticed, the whole bleeping sock is lined in white (and even her navy shoes)!

 

I really wonder sometimes Volks thought process on when they line some items and not others... obviously material plays a factor.. but say Akira's socks, Saber's clothing - you couldnt have some of that lined in white?? Does anyone else wonder that or know of any other items that were lined and it totally took you by surprise??

Edited April 23, 2013 by Guest

I bought the Sailor Uniform Set (Black). The inside of the jacket is lined and the skirt has a white slip built in. What confused me is that the sleeves are not lined. As most DDs wear shirts but they don't always have sleeves, you'd think that the arms would be more important to line than the main shirt to prevent staining on a more visible area.

That's a first! Never heard of lined socks from them before.

Since they have stated that stains aren't considered a 'defect' it's possible that the only reason some items are lined is for easier manufacture. Also linings like the slick material inside of coats can make it easier to dress dolls and layer their clothes, while hiding seams that could snag or look unsightly.

That's really good to know about Lucy's socks, I've got mine on the way and I was really worried about the staining. (Poor girl and Nanami are both stuck waiting for me to pay their custom ransom arghh!)

I've wondered this ever since I found out clothing can stain a DD. I mean, how difficult is it to use materials that don't stain for your outfits? They HAVE to know these clothes stain when they make the sets for the pictures in the Volks Books they have every so often like Volks 40, 42 etc. In doing those photos, they didn't happen to notice the Saber maid set staining within 2 minutes?

 

Anyways, even tho some Volks outfits are lined, this does NOT mean they won't stain. I just found this out the hard way with Mai. I got that cool bartender set I'd been after for ages and saw it was completely lined inside with white, made me super happy since the set is mostly black. I put it on Mai and left it on her for around a week. I decided to change her clothes and when I took off the top, I was devastated to see her chest was pitch black in spots across her boobs and shoulders. I checked where the outfit sat on her skin and it was ALL WHITE. Somehow the black of the outer layers had bled right thru the white liner to her skin. The white areas were still white. I was beyond irate. Luckily I had a spare bust for her to use while I tried to treat the stains. And after 2 weeks of treatments the stains are still there, mocking me.

 

So even when some outfits are lined in white, don't take any chances with them. Either have them on for short periods of time or use a body stocking.

 

I'm still upset that a company who KNOWS it's dolls will stain easily makes clothes they KNOW will stain said dolls. Adding a small warning to all their clothing just means they don't particularly care about the customers. It infuriates me to no end because they make such nice looking clothing. I just hate that some of it will damage my girls if left on for more than a few minutes.

 

I know a lot of collectors in Japan leave their girls as their default and don't change styles and clothes with them often so this may be some of the reasoning behind it. But I think it's mainly due to cost cutting on Volks part with materials.

 

 

Billy

I know how you feel!

I have this beautiful Red Wine Dress: http://www.volksusa.com/ofkor20121001.html

 

It's white lined inside but my poor Beato still got stained with red!

I'm sure white-lined is better for the girls but it's not 100% protected...

Stains through the white lining!? How unfortunate... Talk about a false sense of security. That's sounds like some aggressive dye.

 

I think this is a good topic! Volks outfits people have experience with, lined or not lined?

I think this is an interesting topic. One Volks dress I own that has surprised me (by not staining so far) is this:

 

 

The brown cotton ruffle hasn't seemed to stain the vinyl, although I'm fairly careful with it; sometimes I tuck some muslin underneath to try and block the contact. There is a tulle layer that falls just above the ruffles.

 

 

I have a question/thought to add. Does the department that makes these clothing just not pre wash fabric? Who's to say if they do or don't, but maybe that's a step they skip to manufacture the clothing faster? Not saying that pre washing will get rid of all the excess dye and solve the problem, but maybe it's a factor.

Just so people can see what I'm talking about, here are photos of the staining that happened with the outfit seen here:

 

DSC_0579 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

As you can see here, the inside of this top is lined in white. The black areas on the lapels and collar were NOT touching her skin at all.

 

DSC_0577 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

THIS is what happened after one week in this outfit:

 

DSC_0671 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

DSC_0670 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

And she got a red stain on her leg due to sitting on the red part of the coat:

 

DSC_0669 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

Luckily the red stain is already gone, only took 2 treatments to have it disappear. But after 2 WEEKS of treatments to the bust, the dark stains have only lightened a little. I used an entire tube of Oxy10 on it too. I think it may be a loss at this point so I'll prolly just use this bust to test clothing for staining potential.

 

 

 

Billy

I've wondered this ever since I found out clothing can stain a DD. I mean, how difficult is it to use materials that don't stain for your outfits? They HAVE to know these clothes stain when they make the sets for the pictures in the Volks Books they have every so often like Volks 40, 42 etc. In doing those photos, they didn't happen to notice the Saber maid set staining within 2 minutes?

 

They probably do. Volks' girls they have on display at their stores are stained. You can even see the stains on some of them because the stockings slid down a little or something else along those lines.

 

Just so people can see what I'm talking about, here are photos of the staining that happened with the outfit seen here:

 

Reminds me of the stains that happened thanks to the Natsuki v1 shorts. Only had those on for a short period of time and it got decently dark stains on the legs. They aren't lined, so I wasn't surprised, but I was surprised by how quick it happened.

 

Oddly though, the red and black striped sweater from that outfit, which is also not lined, doesn't seem to stain at all.

 

There doesn't seem to be any guaranteed way to prevent stains. I've had wigs stain a doll's head THROUGH the cloth head cap. I wouldn't be surprised if this could happen if you had a body suit on your doll and the clothes just stain through it. Not to mention that you simply can't use body suits for all outfits. Even though Cool Cat has lots of body suit options, there's outfits that certain bits are uncovered and you'd see the body suit. Sometimes it looks fine, but with some outfits, that wouldn't work. That outfit that you had on your doll in the pics, for instance, wouldn't work with a body suit underneath. You'd see too much of the body suit and it wouldn't look good.

 

Edit: Billy, does Mai have Peach Pai? I'm not 100%, because I don't own a dynamite, but that doesn't look like a standard Volks bust piece. Wondering if that had something to with it. Maybe silicone is more liable to stain (and get deeper stains) than vinyl? Maybe it's harder to clean the stains? I don't know.

I've wondered this ever since I found out clothing can stain a DD. I mean, how difficult is it to use materials that don't stain for your outfits? They HAVE to know these clothes stain when they make the sets for the pictures in the Volks Books they have every so often like Volks 40, 42 etc. In doing those photos, they didn't happen to notice the Saber maid set staining within 2 minutes?

 

They probably do. Volks' girls they have on display at their stores are stained. You can even see the stains on some of them because the stockings slid down a little or something else along those lines.

 

Just so people can see what I'm talking about, here are photos of the staining that happened with the outfit seen here:

 

Reminds me of the stains that happened thanks to the Natsuki v1 shorts. Only had those on for a short period of time and it got decently dark stains on the legs. They aren't lined, so I wasn't surprised, but I was surprised by how quick it happened.

 

Oddly though, the red and black striped sweater from that outfit, which is also not lined, doesn't seem to stain at all.

 

There doesn't seem to be any guaranteed way to prevent stains. I've had wigs stain a doll's head THROUGH the cloth head cap. I wouldn't be surprised if this could happen if you had a body suit on your doll and the clothes just stain through it. Not to mention that you simply can't use body suits for all outfits. Even though Cool Cat has lots of body suit options, there's outfits that certain bits are uncovered and you'd see the body suit. Sometimes it looks fine, but with some outfits, that wouldn't work. That outfit that you had on your doll in the pics, for instance, wouldn't work with a body suit underneath. You'd see too much of the body suit and it wouldn't look good.

 

Edit: Billy, does Mai have Peach Pai? I'm not 100%, because I don't own a dynamite, but that doesn't look like a standard Volks bust piece. Wondering if that had something to with it. Maybe silicone is more liable to stain (and get deeper stains) than vinyl? Maybe it's harder to clean the stains? I don't know.

its a volks bust its just heavily modded

Just so people can see what I'm talking about, here are photos of the staining that happened with the outfit seen here:

 

DSC_0579 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

As you can see here, the inside of this top is lined in white. The black areas on the lapels and collar were NOT touching her skin at all.

 

DSC_0577 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

THIS is what happened after one week in this outfit:

 

DSC_0671 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

DSC_0670 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

 

 

o____________________O

 

holy cow - that's a deep stain! What kind of material is that outfit made of?? Did the white lining not show any signs of color leeching thru it? I've noticed with some of the 'lining' Volks does use it's just the cheapest cotton I've ever seen with a really low thread count, which could account for it not being a really great buffer..

 

I've also wondered with some outfits that do *stain* where some times the dye just sits ontop of the skin say for example the Volks jeans... those stained my DDdy in a day but when I just rubbed her under water it came off immediately whereas the Akira Kitty Pants.. the thread from those shorts dyed immediately and did not come off with just water. You'd think indigo/denim dye would penetrate just as badly and as permanently as this outfit did (and it even had lining! o__o still can't get over that).

 

not to say the body I'm using for the Magical Princess Lucy outfit isn't valuable but at this point it's the oldest and most worn/loved body so I'm kind of seeing how long I can let her wear the lined socks to see if/when they stain. The skirt does sit up against the skin and that is black, but it's not seam-thread contact but just fabric contact (same with her armbands.. yet her chocker is lined in white and not those... wut!?) .. we'll see how it goes o__o

Even white or pastel garments from Volks will stain your doll because of the labels. You can't even trust a pair of white cotton panties from them. Why on earth they use a branding label made from a combination of threads that stain and are sewn into the inside seams of clothing that will lay against the skin, or even pull tightly to the skin, is beyond me. How hard would it be for them to use a thread that does not transfer dye? Or a light color that doesn't transfer either.

 

My first experience with this was a pair of white cotton undies from Volks that I had on my pride and joy - an Obitsu 60cm called Mariko. She'd been wearing them for a few months, and I was changing her and there was a huge stain on her hip, and thigh vinyl. I couldn't believe it, nor could I figure out what stained her at first because she was wearing light colors, nothing dark. Yet there was a big blue/black stain. When I checked everything over and found the brand label, I cursed it....many, many times and loudly.When ever I get a garment from Volks that will lay against the skin, I grab a scalpel or sharp knife and cut the label out. Any dark outfit requires a full coverage white undergarment now, or a body suit.

 

Volks seem to have taken to sewing the label in the main seam now, instead of attaching them separately, so if you nick a stitch, you undo the seam. :/

 

I do think that Volks and others could do more to mitigate and prevent staining than they do. Simply stating that there is a danger of staining and offering stain prevention accessories is not sufficient for me. I think that they should take greater care when manufacturing wigs and garments to reduce the potential for staining, egg-shell or flesh tone wig caps would be a start, as would using clear nylon mono-filament thread to construct wigs.

 

I just don't feel that it's sufficient of Volks or others to make densely dye laden garments that are literally certain to permanently stain a vinyl Doll, specifically for a vinyl doll, and then pretend that their disclaimer is sufficient grounds for them to place all the responsibility on the customer.

 

Saber Alter (the second version) is the perfect case in point. That outfit is certain to stain. what precautions do they take to prevent that? If you use a dense enough body suit to protect your Saver's pale skin from her ourfit, you might as well take Saber's head and hot glue it to a fabric doll since your girl will permanently inhabit a completely opaque body suit from head to toe. It's hardly the elegant, classic look that you think you are buying is it?

Just so people can see what I'm talking about, here are photos of the staining that happened with the outfit seen here:

THIS is what happened after one week in this outfit:

 

DSC_0671 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

DSC_0670 by balldylox, on Flickr

 

 

Good grief that's horrible staining. You know what's really galling about Volks staining disclaimer? It also says on many of the pages that you can't buy replacement vinyl. I know you can for some of the bodies, but not all. Like that Saber Alter with the pale skin. The very least Volks could do is make replacement vinyl available for purchase in these cirbleepstances.

I'm pretty sure there are parts for white skin now too. Luckily..

 

But holy crap Billy, that's an awful stain! >___< It looks like someone painted on her directly!

volks strategy - sell dolls -> sell clothes for dolls that stain -> dolls stain -> sell replacement parts for dolls -> profit

Luckily the red stain is already gone, only took 2 treatments to have it disappear. But after 2 WEEKS of treatments to the bust, the dark stains have only lightened a little. I used an entire tube of Oxy10 on it too. I think it may be a loss at this point so I'll prolly just use this bust to test clothing for staining potential.

Billy

 

I had some really bad staining on Glenda's legs due to some Cool Cat Fishnets, and Remove-Zit eventually took them out.. I was checking her today and that black lacy outfit has stained her upper arms, torso, and waist.. not too bad as I was regularly checking, but am a bit annoyed... not as bad as Mai's but annoying...

 

To answer a few of the questions about the outfit and staining...

 

Mai's bust that is pictured IS the default regular DDdy bust, not a Peach Pai and it's not modded heavily, it just has blushed nips and a neck cut for better head movement. This is the same bust all of the older DDdy base bodies came with.

 

The material on the inside of the outfit ( the white liner ) feels very smooth, like satin or something similar. I'm guessing it's pretty thin. Not sure what the black layer is made of. But it doesn't have that "wet/moist" feel to it like other Volks black material I've seen that stains immediately like the newer Saber Maid set.

 

And yes, the staining DOES look like someone painted it on with a very wet brush, almost like black paint was applied and it ran a little. I've NEVER seen stains that look like this, except across the shoulders in the pics above, those look like normal stains to me. Needless to say, this outfit is getting the hell washed out of it before it goes on anyone else. And then it will only be on them for pics, to be taken off immediately after.

 

I like to think I'm careful with my girls and treat them right by making sure things don't stain them or stay on them too long that might. But to have a lined outfit stain like this, it really made me angry and sad. When one of your most wanted outfits arrives and then proceeds to damage your girl, it's a huge letdown.

 

I also agree with the parts sales being a small part of this problem. You have a stained leg or arm? Buy new ones. That would be fine if they were actually IN STOCK when I needed them! Same thing with the original DDdy bodies. If you stained the arms, shins, feet or bust, no worries, you COULD buy replacement parts. But if you stained or damaged the thighs and lower torso, you were S.O.L. They NEVER released the replacement parts for the DDdy bodies and it really ticked me off. At least now with the newer bodies you can get all of the parts separately if you need to. That is.... if they're in stock when you need them.

 

 

 

Billy

I don't have anything from Volks (yet , but when you think about the price for the outfits in general, you expect something that is "better" than Barbie items for instance. (Come to think of it, I don't really remember having any staining problems when I was a little girl with my dolls)

 

Some would argue that you can take care of the fabric bleeding yourself.

The white vinegar/salt solution trick doesn't work all the time. And when I look at some of the outfits, I wouldn't feel comfortable running them through washes or soaks like that. If I'm paying ~$100 for something, I don't want to risk ruining the dye, shrinking/stretching the fabric, or ruining the stitching the moment I get it unless I'm 100% sure of what I'm doing. (I wonder what fabric each outfit is made of...)

 

If they are going to wash their fabric, they would probably have to add in stuff to help with the bleeding fabric. There are several solutions out there that are fairly inexpensive which will do the job just fine. Take Synthrapol for instance.

 

I don't think satin-like fabric or low-quality cotton is good for either lining or body stockings. You need a high quality fabric. In this case, the phrase "if it looks cheesy, it is cheesy" phrase applies (low quality cosplay outfits are made from satin-like material, so if you've ever seen one, I'm sure you know what I mean).

 

Like I said, I don't have anything from Volks yet, but, if fabric dye is bleeding, I normally think one of these two things.

 

1) It's dark clothing, of course they will use as much dye as possible for a concentrated colour. These jeans are nice though, and I know they will last, so after a couple of washes, they'll fit better and the colour won't bleed into my skin.

 

2) Whoever made this just dunked this into a bunch of dye and didn't bother to care for it afterwards.

 

So yes, you risk staining your doll, and you can take care of that by cleaning the stains, using body stockings, or not letting your doll wear outfits that stain for too long.

We all know (including Volks) that things don't work out perfectly all the time. Take baldylox's staining story. (I hope washing the outfit works out, baldylox! )

 

Oh yes, of course buying extra parts works out for a business. However, frustrating your customers is not a good thing.

I won't have a problem with trying to find ways to avoid stains in the future, but given the price of Volks' items, I personally expect a bit more. Pre-washing the fabric or doing a proper dye treatment (including caring for the fabric after dying) is not a big deal.

I don't think satin-like fabric or low-quality cotton is good for either lining or body stockings. You need a high quality fabric. In this case, the phrase "if it looks cheesy, it is cheesy" phrase applies (low quality cosplay outfits are made from satin-like material, so if you've ever seen one, I'm sure you know what I mean).

 

2) Whoever made this just dunked this into a bunch of dye and didn't bother to care for it afterwards.

 

This is really what I often think. So far I haven't had any problems with staining from clothes made from fabric store fabric, 'repurposed' clothing, or even the socks I used for Naiomi's Halloween dress. I was sure that the black on that would stain her because I bought them from a dollar store and she's a WS, but not one bit. The more I hear about Volk's issues with their clothes staining, I have a hard time not thinking that they use what I call 'doll grade fabric'. They use fabrics that look like they should (dark colors that are over saturated with dye, etc.) because they are selling them as display dolls. If that's true, then they have no reason to care about staining issues.

 

As someone who sews I find that kind of thinking to be ridiculous, and part of why Volk's clothing 'quality' is a rather bad joke around our house. Yuriko's blue striped underwear set had bottoms that would never fit right and were cut out a bit crooked, and the hook on the back of the bra attached to some thread loops that eventually pulled out. Both the Volks shirts I have for Tamayuki have velcro that attacks the seams every time I take them off even when I'm careful. The pants that Miss Kale are the only piece of Volks clothing that I actually really like. I've been very hesitant to get more of their outfits because of the hit and misses we've had with them, and I'm pretty sure the Volks tag in the underwear left a slight mark on Yuriko. I love the DD bodies, but in general I don't trust the Volks clothes.

 

I'm already nervous about Momo's outfit, but the leggings most of all. I already told Raven that I'd suggest that he not use them, but if he insists they will not go on without a bodysuit under them. You can be sure that I'll be going over the inside of her outfit with a fine tooth comb, lining the whole thing if need be. I don't want Raven to finally get his first limited girl and have her stained the first day. It would devastate him. I really do trust Volk's clothes that little.

 

~Sister Kyoya

Those Volks tags are the work of the devil. A staining object in a pair of undies that can ruin one or more pieces of body vinyl in mere days...

 

Sister Kyoya, regarding MOMO (and KOS-MOS for that matter), body suits may be required for both. At the very least some neutral non-staining leggings to go under the thigh highs would seem to be in order.

 

I have a stain protection suit from CoolCats that is a clear nylon mesh. It gives the body a slightly paler look and sheen from the nylon mesh, it protects well without completely obscuring the doll. That body suit might work for KOSMOS as she may actually benefit from the 'sheen'. MOMO, not so much perhaps. I believe that they have even more options for body suits there now, so you may be able to find one that blends even better with the actual skin-tone of the doll.

Don't know if it has been mentioned before, but I think it'd be a good idea if you washed the clothes before putting them on.

Here's a good thread on that.

Picture for those without DoA account.

There's a really good one I refer to on FFM all the time, too!

http://www.figure.fm/post/en/37254/Tutorial+How+to+Color+Lock+and+Stain+Proof+Dollfie+Dream+Clothing.html

There's a really good one I refer to on FFM all the time, too!

http://www.figure.fm/post/en/37254/Tutorial+How+to+Color+Lock+and+Stain+Proof+Dollfie+Dream+Clothing.html

 

I LOVE that tutorial. It has worked very well for me and when I get time I'll be using it on my Saber's Long Cafe Mocha maid set.

 

So....if it is that easy (refers to linked dye locking tutorials (BTW adding vinegar to the wash cycle may help also - or so I have heard), one wonders why the blankety, blank, blank, the folks that make things don't dye fix their fabrics BEFORE using them and BEFORE sending their outfits of doom to stain our ladies. I mean, seriously, even if it adds a couple of extra bucks to the price, I'd bet most of us would be willing to pay that extra instead of go through the horrible nightmare of a favorite girl getting a nasty, and extremely visible stain.